Something strange has happened to American religion. More people are checking “none” when asked about religious affiliation—but that doesn’t necessarily mean they’ve stopped believing in God, looking for meaning, or longing for community.

Historian Diana Butler Bass helps us understand how we got here. Kate and Diana trace the transformation of American evangelicalism from Jimmy Carter to the Religious Right, why Christianity became increasingly entangled with political identity, and what happens when people leave religious institutions but still find themselves reaching for something sacred. Perhaps losing a religious label isn’t always the same thing as losing faith. And perhaps the question isn’t only why people left—but what they’re still hungry for.Kate sits down with novelist Andrew O’Hagan for a funny and tender conversation about friendship: the childhood friends we swear we’ll love forever, the unexpected people who become essential, and the friends who know how to stay when life gets frightening.

Together, they wonder what makes someone a good friend, why some friendships deepen while others fade, and how love sometimes looks less like having the right words and more like simply keeping pace.